Deluge of Atlantis

Deluge of Atlantis
Deluge of Atlantis

Thursday, January 5, 2012

The Hyperborean Dravidian Homeland and the Arctic Origin of the Vedas

Uralic Languages Today
Hyperborian Origin of the Vedas and Veddahs

The Hyperborean Dravidian homeland

For me this had a couple of different starting points. One was a realization that the Russian Mesolithic was actually an Epipaleolithic Reindeer-herding culture possibly carrying on with the independant basketmarked-pottery tradition, but also that the people were basically persisting CroMagnons there AND that the Russian Microlithic industry was the probable source of the Indian microlithic-Mesolithic cultures by way of Central Asia. The Indian Microlithic was flourishing right up until the Indus Civilization began to take over. The other matter was that Charles Hapgood had mentioned literature on the theory of a Polar Paradise and the Arctic origfin of the Vedas. There is actually quite a large literature on this and one source is on the internet and easily accessable in several variant formats:

And I quote from the Chapter 13 summary there:
Proofs of the theory of the Arctic home summed up — They clearly indicate a Polar home, but the exact spot in the Arctic regions, that is, north of Europe or Asia, still undeterminable — An Arctic home possible only in inter-Glacial times according to geology — Ancient Vedic chronology and calendar examined — The interval between the commencement of the Post-Glacial era and the Orion period cannot, according to it, be so great as 80,000 years — Supported by the moderate estimate of the American geologists — Purâṇic chronology of yugas, manvantaras and kalpas — Rangâchârya’s and Aiyer’s views thereon — Later Purâṇic system evolved out of an original cycle of four yugas of [totalling]10,000 years, since the last deluge — The theory of “divine years” unknown to Manu and Vyâsa — Adopted by later writers who could not believe that they lived in the Kṛita age — The original tradition of 10,000 years since the last deluge fully in accord with Vedic chronology — And also with the American estimate of 8,000 B.C. for the beginning of the Post-Glacial period — All prove the existence of a Polar Aryan home before 8,000 B.C. — Trustworthiness of the ancient traditions and the method of preserving them — The theory of the Polar origin of the whole human race not inconsistent with the theory of the Arctic Aryan home — Current views regarding primitive Aryan culture and religion examined — Primitive Aryan man and his civilization cannot now be treated as Post-Glacial — Certain destruction of the primeval civilization and culture by the Ice Age — Short-comings or defects in the civilization of the Neolithic Aryan races in Europe must, therefore, be ascribed to a postdiluvian relapse into barbarism — Life and calendar in the inter-Glacial Arctic home — Devayâna and Pitriyâna and the deities worshipped during the period — The ancient sacrifices of the Aryan race — The degree of civilization reached by the undivided Aryans in their Arctic home — The results of Comparative Philology stated — The civilization disclosed by them must be taken to be the minimum or the lowest, that can be predicated of the undivided Aryans — The culture of the undivided Aryans higher than the culture of the Stone or the Metal age — Use of metal coins among them highly probable — Beginnings of the Aryan language, or the differentiation of human races according to color or language still untraceable — The origin of Aryan man and religion lost in geological antiquity — Theological views regarding the origin and character of the Vedas summarized — Differently supported by writers on the different schools of philosophy — Patanjali’s and Vyâsa’s view that the Vedas were lost in the last deluge and repromulgated in substance, if not in form, at the beginning of the new age — The four periods into which the Post-Glacial era may be divided on astronomical grounds — Compared with the characteristics of the four yugas given in the Aitareya Brâhmaṇa — Theological and historical views regarding the origin &c. of the Vedas stated in parallel columns and compared — Vedic texts, showing that the subject matter of the hymns is ancient though the language may be new, cited — Vedic deities and their exploits all said to be ancient — Improbability of Dr. Muir’s suggested reconciliation — Vedas, or rather Vedic religion, shown to be inter-Glacial in substance though post-Glacial in form — Concluding remarks.

--Now if the evidence is true as presented, we are not only just talking a cold climate such as we might find in the Himalayas closer to India, we are talking a very high latitude and at least some experience of conditions actually within the Arctic Circle. Such that even the Scythians on the Russian Steppes would not have gone far enough. We are talking the extreme Noorthern part of Asia, the area that Herodutus called Hyperboria. That seems to correspond to the territory of the Uralic peoples as shown on the map. Then a solution presented itself to me, which while entirely unorthodox solves the problem very well: The Vedas are not originally Aryan. They are Dravidian and transmitted through the Indus valley culture, and from the Dravidian origins up in Uralic Territory. Furthermore it seems the Uralic Reindeer-herders might even have had a knowledge of horses in those remote days. The references to reindeer in the original would doubtless later be translated as cows The Dravidian Indus texts would have been copied over again later by Satem-Indo-European scribes and here we have the exact same situation as we have in Mesopotamia when the original Sumerian texts were all copied out into Semitic translations by the Akkadians, ancestors of the Assyrians.
Urheimat (a German compound of Ur- "primitive, original" and Heimat "home, homeland"; German pronunciation:[ˈʔuːɐ̯ˌhaɪmaːt], English: /ˈʊərhaɪmɑːt/) is a linguistic term denoting the original homeland of the speakers of a proto-language. The homelands of many, but not all, major language families are summarized in this article.
Dravidian homeland
The Dravidian languages have been found mainly in South India since at least the second century BCE (inscriptions, ed. I. Mahadevan 2003). It is, however, a widely held hypothesis that Dravidian speakers may have been more widespread throughout India, including the northwest region[2] before the arrival of Indo-European speakers. A map showing where Dravidian languages are spoken today appears to the left.
Historical records suggest that the South Dravidian language group had separated from a Proto-Dravidian language no later than 700 BCE, linguistic evidence suggests that they probably became distinctive around 1,100 BCE, and some scholars using linguistic methods put the deepest divisions in the language group at roughly 3,000 BCE.[3] Russian linguist M.S. Andronov puts the split between Tamil (a written Southern Dravidian language) and Telugu (a written Central Dravidian language) at 1,500 BCE to 1,000 BCE.[4]
Southworth identifies late Proto-Dravidian with the Southern Neolithic culture in the lower Godavari River basin of South Central India, which first appeared ca. 2,500 BCE, based upon its agricultural vocabulary, while noting that this "would not preclude the possibility that speakers of an earlier stage of Dravidian entered the subcontinent from western or central Asia, as has often been suggested."[5]
Speculations regarding the original homeland have centered on the Indus Valley Civilization, or on Elam, whose language was spoken in the hills to the east of the ancient Sumerian civilization with whom the Indus Valley Civilization traded and shared domesticated species) in an Elamo-Dravidian hypothesis, but results have not been convincing. The possibility that the language family is indigenous to the Dravidian area and is a truly isolated genetic unit has also not been ruled out.
Prof. Asko Parpola (University of Helsinki), the Jesuit priest Father Heras in the 1930s and other scholars (such as Indian and early Tamil expert Iravatham Mahadevan and Prof. Walter A. Fairservis Jr.) conclude that the Indus sign system represented an ancient Dravidian language, a view that they assume is supported by Tamil artifacts discovered in 2006.[6] Thus, in Parpola's view, the urheimat of Dravidian would be in the Indus River Valley. However, Harvard Indologist Michael Witzel takes the view that has received serious academic consideration (ca. 2004), which is critical of an Indus Valley Civilization Dravidian homeland and of the widely held view that the inscriptions of the Indus Valley Civilization even constitute a written language.[7] In the essay "Substrate Languages in Old Indo-Aryan" (with RV in this context referring to Rigvedic, i.e. Indo-Aryan), Witzel says "As we can no longer reckon with Dravidian influence on the early RV, this means that the language of the pre-Rigvedic Indus civilization, at least in the Panjab, was of (Para-) Austro-Asiatic nature." There are no written examples of Austro-Asiatic languages being spoken further west than Central India during the recent historical era (i. e., in the era for which we have written records).
Recent studies of the distribution of alleles on the Y chromosome,[8] microsatellite DNA,[9] and mitochondrial DNA[10] in India have cast doubt for a biological Dravidian "race" distinct from non-Dravidians in the Indian subcontinent;[11] other recent genetic studies have found evidence of Aryan, Dravidian and pre-Dravidian (original Asian) strata in South Asian populations.[12] Geneticist Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza proposes that a Dravidian people were preceded in India by Austro-Asiatic people, and were present prior to the arrival of Indo-Aryan language speakers in India.[This is actually the standard viewpoint-DD] [13] 

Uralic homeland

The Uralic homeland is unknown. A possible locus is the Comb Ceramic Culture of ca 4200 – ca 2000 BC (shown on the map to the right in purple). This is suggested by the high language diversity around the middle Volga River, where three highly distinct branches of the Uralic family, Mordvinic, Mari, and Permic, are located. Reconstructed plant and animal names (including spruce, Siberian pine, Siberian Fir, Siberian larch, brittle willow, elm, and hedgehog) are consistent with this location. This is adjacent to the proposed homeland for Proto-Indo-European under the Kurgan hypothesis.
French anthropologist Bernard Sergent, in La Genèse de l'Inde (1997),[14] argued that Finno-Ugric (Uralic) may have a genetic source or have borrowed significantly from proto-Dravidian or a predecessor language of West African origins. Some linguists see Uralic (Hungarian, Finnish) as having a linguistic relationship to both Altaic (Turkic, Mongol) language groups[15] (as in the outdated Ural-Altaic hypothesis) and Dravidian languages. The theory that the Dravidian languages display similarities with the Uralic language group, suggesting a prolonged period of contact in the past,[16] is popular amongst Dravidian linguists and has been supported by a number of scholars, including Robert Caldwell,[17] Thomas Burrow,[18] Kamil Zvelebil,[19] and Mikhail Andronov[20] This theory has, however, been rejected by some specialists in Uralic languages,[21] and has in recent times also been criticised by other Dravidian linguists like Bhadriraju Krishnamurti.[22]
[Emphasis added by Dale D.]

As noted below, many notable linguists have proposed that the Eskimo-Aleut languages and Uralic languages have a common origin, although there is not a consensus that this connection is genuine.

  1. ^ Herwig Wolfram, Die Germanen, Beck (1999).
  2. ^ "Dravidian languages." Encyclopædia Britannica. 2008. Encyclopædia Britannica Online. 5 June 2008
  3. ^ Bhadriraju Krishnamurti, The Dravidian Languages (2003) reviewed at
  4. ^ Moorti, Etukoori Balaraama in Andhra Samkshipta Charitra, Proto-Dravidian Study of Dravidian Linguistics and Civilization
  5. ^ F.C. Southworth, "Proto-Dravidian Agriculture" (2006)
  6. ^ Asko Parpola, Introduction to Study of the Indus Script,
  7. ^ Witzel, Michael (2004). "Substrate Languages in Old Indo-Aryan"
  8. ^ Sahoo, S.; Singh, A; Himabindu, G; Banerjee, J; Sitalaximi, T; Gaikwad, S; Trivedi, R; Endicott, P et al. (2006), "A prehistory of Indian Y chromosomes: Evaluating demic diffusion scenarios", Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences 103 (4): 843–8, Bibcode 2006PNAS..103..843S, doi:10.1073/pnas.0507714103, PMC 1347984, PMID 16415161, 
  9. ^ Sengupta, S; Zhivotovsky, LA; King, R; Mehdi, SQ; Edmonds, CA; Chow, CE; Lin, AA; Mitra, M et al. (2006), "Polarity and temporality of high-resolution y-chromosome distributions in India identify both indigenous and exogenous expansions and reveal minor genetic influence of Central Asian pastoralists.", American journal of human genetics 78 (2): 202–21, doi:10.1086/499411, PMC 1380230, PMID 16400607, 
  10. ^ Sharma, Swarkar; Saha, Anjana; Rai, Ekta; Bhat, Audesh; Bamezai, Ramesh (2005), "Human mtDNA hypervariable regions, HVR I and II, hint at deep common maternal founder and subsequent maternal gene flow in Indian population groups", Journal of Human Genetics 50 (10): 497–506, doi:10.1007/s10038-005-0284-2, PMID 16205836 
  11. ^ Human Genome Diversity Project
  12. ^ Majumder, Partha P. (2010), "The Human Genetic History of South Asia", Current Biology 20 (4): R184–7, doi:10.1016/j.cub.2009.11.053, PMID 20178765 
  13. ^ Cavalli-Sforza, "The History and Geography of Human Genes" (1994)[page needed]
  14. ^ Sergent, Bernard Sergent, La Genèse de l'Inde (Paris, Payot, 1997) chapter (pp. 45–84) on "Dravidians and Melano-Indians" translated from French by Visuvalingam, Sunthar.
  15. ^ "Dravidian languages." Encyclopædia Britannica. 2008. Encyclopædia Britannica Online. 30 Jun. 2008
  16. ^ Tyler, Stephen (1968), "Dravidian and Uralian: the lexical evidence", Language 44 (4): 798–812, doi:10.2307/411899. 
  17. ^ Webb, Edward (1860), "Evidences of the Scythian Affinities of the Dravidian Languages, Condensed and Arranged from Rev. R. Caldwell's Comparative Dravidian Grammar", Journal of the American Oriental Society 7: 271–298, doi:10.2307/592159. 
  18. ^ Burrow, T. (1944), "Dravidian Studies IV: The Body in Dravidian and Uralian", Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies 11 (2): 328–356. 
  19. ^ Zvelebil, Kamal (2006). Dravidian Languages. In Encyclopædia Britannica (DVD edition).
  20. ^ Andronov, Mikhail S. (1971), "Comparative Studies on the Nature of Dravidian-Uralian Parallels: A Peep into the Prehistory of Language Families". Proceedings of the Second International Conference of Tamil Studies Madras. 267–277.
  21. ^ Zvelebil, Kamal (1970), Comparative Dravidian Phonology Mouton, The Hauge. at p. 22 contains a bibliography of articles supporting and opposing the theory
  22. ^ Krishnamurti, Bhadriraju (2003) The Dravidian Languages Cambridge University Press, Cambridge. ISBN 0-521-77111-0 at p. 43.

More on the Polar Origin of the Vedas:

The Arctic Home in the Vedas is a seminal work on the origin of Aryans presented by LokmanyaBal Gangadhar Tilak, a mathematician turned astronomer, historian, journalist, philosopher and political leader of India during 1880 to 1920. It propounded the theory that North Pole was the original home of Aryans during pre-glacial period which they had to leave due to the ice deluge around 8000 B.C. and had to migrate to the Northern parts of Europe and Asia in search of lands for new settlements. In support to his theory Tilak has presented certain Vedic hymns, Avestic passages, Vedic chronology and Vedic calendars with interpretations of the contents in detail. The book was written at the end of 1898 but was first published in March 1903 in Pune.


  • According to the latest geological evidence, the last Glacial period must have closed and Post-Glacial must have commenced at about 10,000 years ago or 8,000 BC. There were at least two Glacial and one Inter-Glacial period, and the geographical distribution of land and water on the earth during the Inter-Glacial period was quite different from what it is at present. It was the coming on of the Glacial age that destroyed this genial climate and rendered the regions unsuited for the habitation of tropical plants and animals.
  • At North Pole one sees the heavenly dome above will seem to revolve round him like a potter’s wheel. The stars will not rise and set but move round and round in horizontal planes during the long night of six months. The Sun, when he is above the horizon for six months; would also appear to revolve in the same way but with some difference. The Northern celestial hemisphere will alone be visible spinning round and round and the Southern half remain invisible. The Sun going into the Northern hemisphere in his annual course will appear as coming up from the South. Living in the temperate and tropical zones, however, one sees all heavenly objects rise in the East and set in the West, some passing over the head, others traveling obliquely.
  • The long dawn of two months is a special and important characteristic of the North Pole. As we descend southward, the splendor and the duration of the dawn will be witnessed on a less and less magnificent scale. But the dawn occurring at the end of the long night of two, three or more months will still be unusually long, often of several days duration.
  • All these characteristics of Arctic home are clearly recorded in several Vedic hymns and Avestic passages and they come to us sometimes as the description of the prevailing conditions or the day-to-day experience or stories told by the earlier generation and sometimes as myths.
  • [It is entirely possible that the Indo-Europeans heard about these things and passed the stories along, but the original observations would have had to be made in the Uralic Homeland. Hence it looks like the Vedas and Eddas have a common source with the Kalevala in the postglacial Asiatic Hyperboria-DD]

  • Chronology of the Post-Glacial period

    Tilak in his Study
    • 10,000 to 8000 BC – The Destruction of the original Arctic home by the last Ice Age and the commencement of the post-Glacial period.
    • 8000 to 5000 BC – The age of migration from the original home. The survivors of the Aryan race roamed over the northern parts of Europe and Asia in search of lands suitable for new settlements. Tilak calls it as ‘Pre-Orion Period’.
    • 5000 to 3000 BC. - The Orion period, when the vernal equinox was in Orion. Many Vedic hymns can be traced to the early part of this period and the bards of the race seem to have not yet forgotten the real importance of the traditions of the Arctic home inherited by them. It was at this time that first attempts to reform the calendar and the sacrificial system appear to have been systematically made.
    • 3000 to 1400 BC – The Krittika period, when the Vernal equinox was in Pleiades. The traditions about the original Arctic home had grown dim by this time and very often misunderstood, making the Vedic hymns more and more unintelligible.
    • 1400 to 500 BC – The Pre-Buddhistic period, when the Sutras and the Philosophical systems made their appearance.[After Buddhism arose, mis once again spread Indic traditions over Central Asia]


    The book has about 500 pages containing a Preface by the Author and thirteen chapters viz 1. ‘Prehistoric Times’ 2. The Glacial Period 3. The Arctic Regions 4. The Night of the Gods 5.The Vedic Dawns 6. Long Day and Long Night 7. Months and Seasons 8. The Cow’s Walk 9. Vedic Myths – The Captive Waters 10. Vedic Myths – The Matutinal Deities 11. The Avestic Evidence 12. Comparative Mythology. 13. The Bearing of our Results on the History of Primitive Aryan Culture and Religion. At the end, a General Index and Index of Vedic and Avestic Passages are given.

    Evidence in Support of the Theory

    1) Vedic Evidences
    2) Avestic Evidences
    • Particulars of Vendidad passages are given.
    • Particulars of Yashts passages are given.
    • Particulars of Yasna passages are given.


    Neolithic-age representations of horses and other animals, indicating probable domestication of horses and reindeer in Russia. If so then the early Indo-europeans of the Kurgan culture got their horses from the Uralics living nearby, possibly with some large exchanges of Folklore and beliefs. NB, I believe Kurgan culture to represent Satem-Indo-Europeans and that the Centum-Speakers had already separated from them.
    Very early Uralic cultures in European Russia, including range of Comb-pitted ware. The origins of the Uralic peoples goes back into the days of the deglaciation since the Glacial Maximum at about 20000 years ago, on the shores of the inland sea that filled the Ob basin at the time, Glacial Lake Mansi. This vast body of water acted as an insulator to warm up the surrounding areas and thus it could be quite comfortable up to very high latitudes. This would go well with Tilak's investigations of the ancient scriptures.
    Comb-pitted potsherd
    Skulls from the Middle Volga region. These are a recognisable small/reduced-Cromagnon type. There are also larger and more rugged, and more roundheaded types of skulls in the area.

    Forensic reconstruction sculptures of skulls from the middle Volga region, by the great Russian restorationist G. G. Gerasimov. The woman above and the man below: there is a general resemblance to some people still living in India today. Gerasimov did many of these and the range of features in this population is remarkable. The area was evidently undergoing a great deal of ethnic mixing from diverse sources at the time. 

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